JAN 16th - A GREAT BOOK ON SHIPWRECKS - DO YOU KNOW WHERE THESE WRECKS ARE? ECs WRECK HUNT STASH-

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JAN 16th - A GREAT BOOK ON SHIPWRECKS - DO YOU KNOW WHERE THESE WRECKS ARE? ECs WRECK HUNT STASH-

Postby EC NEWELLMAN » Sat Jan 16, 2010 11:31 am

I can remember the day over 30 years ago that Red told me to meet him at Stella Maris since he was going to give me something that would change my life, and turn me into the wreck looking hunga that I would become. It was a small green piece of paper with 6 or so wrecks scribbled on it, and Red told me that if you go to these spots, 'You'll Catch Some Fish'.

From the day my pursuit on getting, looking and talking about wrecks and obstructions from North Carolina northwards to Maine was started, and I can say that this HOLY GRAIL quest has led to meeting many incredible life long friends, as well as a few unscrupulous individuals who put the 'numbers' first before friendship.

But let us open up this special thread with this, a book that few mention, and which is loaded with an incredible amount of information on our Long Island shipwrecks.

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This was written a little over a decade ago and delves into the history of vessels sinking off the shores of Long Island. Inside of the book, is an old map that shows numerous vessels that have sunk off the south shore of Long Island going back over a century ago.

What is more amazing here, is that the book can be read online via GOOGLEs books, and can be viewed right here along with a number of images on vessels that have sunk like the Iberia, Hylton Castle, Oregon and others:

Lost voyages: two centuries of shipwrecks in the approaches to New York By Bradley Sheard


Over the years, I have documented many excellent books about fishing, whether on issues effecting the life of fishermen:

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The history of the foreign fleet coming to our shores, and a book Captain Richie Kessinger always talks about:

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Or a book about survival against the toughest odds in the winter when a number of commercial vessels sunk off southern Massachusetts and Rhode Island over a few days, most notable the DETERMINED:

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So here I start a list of vessels that have sunk and which a number of us have fished over the years, and a good number that have not been located as of this time. I should point out that this list was put together over 20 years ago by Tim Coleman, who I consider the leading fishermen/researcher on shipwrecks off New England to New York waters.

Now I ask, can you add to this list from Montauk east to Nantucket, or do you have any stories about these commercial vessels that are now wrecks? Do I hear crickets, or will some of you talk about fishing or finding these wrecks?

BROTHERS II - SUNK SEPT. 82'
CAROL & DENNIS - AUGUST 72' - MONTAUK
ELMO aka TOOTHFAIRY - OCT 88' - MONTAUK
FAIR WIND - 55' - NOV 80' - DEEP NANTUCKET
FOUR BROTHERS - JULY 85'
JOSHUA B - AUG 61' - MONTAUK
MANDALAY - APR 62' - MONTAUK
NORTHERN DAWN - 1956
SUSAN FRANCIS - APR 88'
ANDREW & ALLISON - JAN' 87'
ALLEY CAT - NOV 81' = SOUTH OF BLOCK ISLAND
BARBARA CHRISTINE - 59' - NOV 80' - S/W NANTUCKET
BETSY C - APR 59' - WEST SIDE COXES LEDGE
BRENDA LOUISE - UNK - NOMANS
CLARA T - FEB 54' - BLOCK ISLAND
DETERMINED - 76' - NOV 80' - SOUTHERN RHODE ISLAND
DOROTHY & BETTY - JAN 49'
DOROTHY & MARY - NOV 61' - NANTUCKET
DOREEN LEE - SEPT 68' - SOUTHERN MASS.
DUTCHESS - AUG 81' - NOMANS
EC NEWELL MAN - UNK - EAST OF MONTAUK
ELIPITCAL - UNK - DEEP NANTUCKET
EUGENE & ROSE (CABLE) - SOUTHERN RHODE ISLAND
FILLET - UNK - DEEP EDGE SOUTHERN RHODE ISLAND
GREAT ISLANDER - SEPT 87' - SOUTHERN MASS.
HARRY GLENN - UNK - NANTUCKET
JENNY & JACKIE - AUG 82 - NOMANS
JOANNA- UNK - SOUTHERN MASS.
LITTLE GROWLER -OCT 83' - NOMANS
LITTLE SAM - AUG 58'
LOBSTA 1 - SEPT 78' - SOUTHERN RHODE ISLAND
MARDI GRAS - SEPT 72'
MARYANN - UNK -SOUTHERN RHODE ISLAND
MAIDEN CREEK - KNOWN - DEEP MONTAUK
MISS JENNIFER - UNK - BLOCK ISLAND
NORDSTRUM - UNK - SOUTHERN RHODE ISLAND
NORTHERN LIGHTS - NOV 84' - SOUTHERN RHODE ISLAND
OLIVE M. WILLIAMS - UNK
OUR LADY OF FATIMA - JUN 81'
NATHANIEL PALMER - APR 45 - BLOCK ISLAND
PAT & JUDY - UNK - SOUTHERN RHODE ISLAND
POCAHANTUS - UNK - SOUTH OF COXES LEDGE
PONCE DE LEON - NOV 56'
PORTUGAL - MAY 65'
ROBERT E - DEC 78' - MONTAUK
R.W. GRIFFIN - JULY 58'
SAINT JOHN - AUG 73' - SOUTHERN MASS.
SCROD - AUG 77'
SKIMMER - UNK - SW GROUNDS
SOL E MAR -MAR 90' - NOMANS
SOUTHERN CROSS - UNK - SOUTHERN MASS.
SPIRIT OF 76 - UNK - COXES
STAR OF THE SEA - FEB 60' - SOUTHERN MASS.
SUE C II - UNK - NOMANS
TOSCIN - JUN 71'
UNITED STATES - DEC 78'
VALIANT LADY -UNK - MONTAUK
WIND BLOWN - 1984
WINSLOW - UNK - MONTAUK
ZERDA - SEPT 82'



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Re: JAN 16th - A GREAT BOOK ON SHIPWRECKS - DO YOU KNOW WHERE THESE WRECKS ARE? ECs WRECK HUNT STASH-

Postby togtooth01 » Sat Jan 16, 2010 2:15 pm

EC,

Looks like another great read. I can vouch for Distant Waters...was definately a good and fascinating book to be recommended...

I fish primarily out of Moriches...
Looking closely at pg 71, it is amazing looking at the history and possibilities that are there. I believe i have fished the Randall which is now "hard bottom" for some big fluke in the summer and keeper size blacks in the fall...
Gates City is well known...

Still lookin for the one you referred to as the "pavillion" a few years back...

Tog
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Re: JAN 16th - A GREAT BOOK ON SHIPWRECKS - DO YOU KNOW WHERE THESE WRECKS ARE? ECs WRECK HUNT STASH-

Postby EC NEWELLMAN » Sat Jan 16, 2010 2:26 pm

Tog, thank you.....

In another thread that will come later on, I will talk about wrecks that are no longer there but were fished up to 15 years ago, and a few happen to be off Moriches.

One hard bottom wreck that comes to mind now, is the ZEELINER, which was scuttled a number of years back off Fire Island near the reef.

Again, let me save this discussion for another thread though.....

And, we will talk about the PAVILLION, but I know I might get a 'little grief' over it!
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Re: JAN 16th - A GREAT BOOK ON SHIPWRECKS - DO YOU KNOW WHERE THESE WRECKS ARE? ECs WRECK HUNT STASH-

Postby fishpro » Mon Jan 18, 2010 1:05 am

The Pavillion is gone nothing left to it.
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Re: JAN 16th - A GREAT BOOK ON SHIPWRECKS - DO YOU KNOW WHERE THESE WRECKS ARE? ECs WRECK HUNT STASH-

Postby Capt. AVK » Tue Jan 19, 2010 3:15 pm

I'm going to read some of those books you posted Steve...all seem like excellent reads. I love wrecks for more than the fact they are fish producing entities, I'm a history buff so I love the history behind the wrecks, why did they sink, how did they sink, was the wreck a war casualty, collision, etc, etc. When I'm coming over a piece and start to see it rise on my bottom machine, my heart skips a beat in all the excitment. I particularly like the relatively unidentified pieces that aren't covered in Wreck Valley and whatnot. The mystery of whats on the bottom if fascinating. Next year one of my projects is to become certified in diving.

There are some good reads about local wrecks. Fatal Depth and Deep Descent are books about diving the Doria, but also mention other various wrecks around LI. Shadow Divers and The Last Dive are also great books about wrecks around LI but focus mainly on the U-869 (U-Who).

Steve, speaking of foreign fleets and Richie Kessinger, when are you going to write that article about Richie Kessinger v. Soviet Trawler you promised us a while back. We have been anxiously waiting all this time ! ;)

BTW That wreck called "ECNM" wreck identified as being east of Montauk is filled with nothing but dogfish. Not worth fishing at all.
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Re: JAN 16th - A GREAT BOOK ON SHIPWRECKS - DO YOU KNOW WHERE THESE WRECKS ARE? ECs WRECK HUNT STASH-

Postby EC NEWELLMAN » Tue Jan 19, 2010 3:20 pm

Capt. AVK...how are you?

Ok....Richie is now in Florida and will not be back in a few months. I like to get a picture of the letter from the government, when his anchor was grabbed and his boat pulled by a foreign trawler.

Like I said, that is going to take a few months, unless I talk to Richie again and ask him to tell me the story...good one though.

What I may do in it's place, is put up a article I have been saving on a virgin wreck trip I did with Richie a few years back. That one was a good one!

From speaking to a diver I work with who dove on U-869, the sub has had its bow torn off and moved, most likely by a commercial fishing trawler.

I will keep you all in the loop for these upcoming stories.
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Re: JAN 16th - A GREAT BOOK ON SHIPWRECKS - DO YOU KNOW WHERE THESE WRECKS ARE? ECs WRECK HUNT STASH-

Postby onemorefish » Fri Jan 22, 2010 11:54 pm

I might have one to add to the east
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Re: JAN 16th - A GREAT BOOK ON SHIPWRECKS - DO YOU KNOW WHERE THESE WRECKS ARE? ECs WRECK HUNT STASH-

Postby EC NEWELLMAN » Sat Jan 23, 2010 9:50 am

Good morning Dave....I bet you do!

I received a call from a commercial fishermen from out east who also told me that I missed a few. Yes I did, and there are a number of wrecks that went down from the late 1800s through 2000 that are called ONE name by fishermen, but are not the correct name of the vessel that sunk. Here is another special list also complied by wreck master Tim Coleman

DEEP ONES


FILLET - Converted tug into a fishing trawler - 40-06 x 71-00 sunk in 85 ftms
BIELA - British 'STEAMER' wk - sank 5.5 miles east of the Fillet
ZERDA - Eastern rig - 40-08 x 70-42 - sank 3 miles northeast of Biela
OIL WRECK - unk vessel sunk BEFORE WWII @ 40-06 x 69-55 - rises up 48 feet
400' - unk 17 miles east of OIL Wk - sits 40-06 x 69-31 - rises up 60 feet off bottom!
SEBASTIAN -WWI freighter went down due to on board fire - fished since early 1980s

aka 'MONSTER' - Wreck of the 502' tanker Fort Mercer that split into two pieces due to a fierce northeast storm in 1952. Sits 85 miles southeast of Nantucket and 120 miles from Montauk and was found by one of the legends in offshore cod fishing a number of years back. The bow which became a hazard to navigation was intentionally scuttled by Coast Guard gunfire and now sits in 64 fathoms of water, while the stern was recovered and taken into tow by a large tugboat back to Cape Cod.

The location of these wrecks are noted in many of the older hang logs that are being passed around these days. Many of them have nets and trawler gear left on them, and for those who have fished these deep wrecks, reeling up from over 300 feet off the bottom and getting hung up after 10 cranks is pretty frustrating. But that is all part and parcel for those who want to pull sometimes trophy sized white hake, pollock, codfish, and even golden tilefish out of the deep on and around them.

From North Carolina northward to southern Massachusetts waters, there are literally a few hundred large wrecks that sank up on top of the canyon ledges, and right along the slopes. They can be very hard to fish, especially wrecks that are 100 feet or less in length. Strong currents force fishermen to use heavier weights up to two pounds to get down to the bottom....strong winds make drifting sometimes impossible, even on wrecks that are greater then 300 feet in length.

From speaking to a number of dragger captains over the years, the deep wrecks had gear left on them most notably by the foreign invaders who plied the shores here from the late 50s through the early 70s. Due to this, some of these wrecks are almost impossible to fish if the conditions are not perfect, since the amount of lost tackle that will eventually be left in the 'ghost gear', makes fishing them sometimes not worth the effort, unless the fishing vessel has anglers willing to voluntarily donate some expensive terminal tackle to the bottom.

Of an interesting note, many of the offshore deep wrecks will be there for years, since they typically are steel wrecks and deteriorate slowly. The older wooden sailing ships and barges that sank in the 19th and 20th century, are sadly disappearing, both to the effects of the marine environment, but also to both groundfish trawls and scallop dredges which bust them apart as the gear runs up and against these aging wooden ships.

Hang logs have a number of references marked 'TIMBER' written in them to indicate the wood planking of these old vessels that are brought up in their nets, and caught within their dredge. Many times as these ships are hit by commercial gear, sections are broken off and scattered near and around the wreck. These little pimples become noted as hangs, stick ups and unknown obstructions that become the 'honey holes' for those sharp wreck captains who look to them as 'cooler fillers' or 'day saver' drops since they are not known to other wreck fishermen.

Since this one post is focusing in on those 'deep ones' that we look to fish, one must remember that even if you do luck out in finding an old wooden ship wreck in over 40 fathom of water, the effort in fishing the small debris field, or ribs of the vessel are just too much for the average wreck fishermen to successfully do, especially when the current and wind can make even the best offshore wreck captains conduct anchor drills.

Thankfully there are still a number of top notch offshore party boat wreck captains around who will take us to the 'deep ones'.
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