DEC 27 - FISHING UNITED.COM SPECIAL ARTICLE - WHO FOUND & FIRST FISHED THE SOUTH SHORE OF LONG ISLAND CODFISH WRECKS FROM 40s THROUGH THE 70s

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DEC 27 - FISHING UNITED.COM SPECIAL ARTICLE - WHO FOUND & FIRST FISHED THE SOUTH SHORE OF LONG ISLAND CODFISH WRECKS FROM 40s THROUGH THE 70s

Postby EC NEWELLMAN » Mon Dec 27, 2010 10:41 pm

Here is a little something special that I have been saving for a while, and now with the winter upon us this is one which will bring back memories and of cause spur much debate as you will see. This was a list I complied with the help of one of the legendary captains who was in the business post World War II and just happened to specialize in finding and fishing wrecks in this area.

Now I know there will be a few out there who will question who found some of these spots and I have no problem making corrections once they are verified.

I also like everyone to keep in mind that a number of wrecks were found by one fishing operation that for years have kept the name and location secret only to have some other fishing operation then find it and claim it as their boat finding a new virgin wreck. There is much that can then be debated on who found a wreck in these cases, but I can tell you that as a rule, those party boats which commonly ventured offshore typically were generally the first to find these noted codfish spots.

Unlike any other area on this coast, the NY BIGHT does have the greatest cluster of ship wrecks and assorted rockpiles scattered within a 40 mile or so vicinity of the Port of New York. Many have been found over the years, and a number have now crumbled away due to the effects of the marine environment. This is a list of the most noted that I have put together that were codfish king-pins from back in the day.

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20 MILE WRECKS


HAPPY DAYS - Found by Lobsetman Bill Whoety (sp) who gave the loran A numbers to Captain Al of a big wreck in the area.

G&D -Dragger Terry Lee had towed into it while towing for scup. Captain Phil Ruhle who was out of the Baldwin/Freeport area with his dragger gave it to Captain Al who was the first to fish it.

3 FARES - Found by Captain Jay Porter using a scanner with 3 fares on the boat that day.

59 lb - Captain Al running the Viking 7 from the now sunk Experimental Buoy to the Yankee ran it over. Caught a 59 pound cod on it that very day. Al got this wreck from a set of Phil Ruhle numbers.

YANKEE -Originally found by the Walsh brothers, who gave it to Captain Al, and another Phil Ruhle set of Loran A numbers that he had since this was the largest wreck in the area.

SKIPPY - Captain Buddy Dorman (Yankee Skipper) found it running one day from the Yankee to the F.I. Lightship and ran it over and was seen turning around and doing circles for a period of time on it. Billy 'Bubbles' dove on it later on and got the Bell off it and found it was the Tarantula.

IRMA C - Found by Billy Granau who owned the clam boat Enterprise while towing with the dragger IRMA C east of the G&D, left both his net and a buoy on it.

DOUBLE SCHOONERS - Bill Whoety (sp) who found the Happy Days, had lobster pots around this piece of bottom.

ELAC - Captain Richie Kessinger while scanning for the Yankee and ended up to far offshore of it, found this small wreck.

EXPERIMENTAL BUOY - Sunk by Captain Jay Porter, found by Captain Stan Joseph of the Captain Joseph from Captree.

FLORENCE - Open bottom cod fish found by Sy Collins, west north west of the G&D.

RICHIES TUG aka LOST TUG - Found by Dennis Bogan. Captain Richie Kessinger got it from John Larson the diver who said it looked like a tug boat. Originally a scalloper had got hung up on it and that is how this interesting set of numbers got out.

FIRE ISLAND


OREGON - Joseph family had it first. Dragger had left a buoy to mark it.

SAN DIEGO - Believe it or not, a private boat coming back from Montauk found a buoy marking it. The boat then ran due north (inshore) took ranges, then ran back out using time and course.

LINDA - Dragger Gannett gave the Loran A numbers to Captain Jay Porter while they talked in the shipyard. George Linley of the Jess-Lu had it though.

WOLCOTT - Captain Fred Wrege owner of the Effort, paid a dragger captain 500 dollars for the location where he left his net. The draggerman told him how good the fishing was around that area, thus the big money paid to find out where the Wolcott was.

DODGER - Fred Wrege named it, but party boat Flash 2 found it while drifting for mackerel, threw anchor and landed on it in June 1948/1949.

REGGIE - Steel boat that Captain Fred Wrege would run to and fish on his Fire Island trips.

NA WRECK - Captain Jay Porter given the Loran A numbers to.

CLOSED BARGE - Supposedly fished first by the Eddie B, called by Captain Scotty the 'mussel'.

HYLTON CASTLE - Found by George Linley of the Jess-Lu running to the San Diego.

EAST & OFFSHORE


COIMBRA -Originally run over by the TALLY 5 (TALLY BUICK) whose crew happened to be friendly with Captain Jay Porter.

VIRGINIA - Captain Jay Porter using early government AWOIS numbers.

DAILY BREAD - Bruce Larson hung with the dragger Daily Bread and gave Captain RIchie Kessinger the numbers. Later on Captain Joe Bogan coming across on a offshore wreck trip saw Richie in the distance and it was the only offshore wreck that he was ever seen on...thankfully they were good friends!

COW - Draggerman Jimmy Mathews of the Christina Alexa hung up on what is supposed to be a old wooden dragger.

SOUTH - EAST - WEST OF CHOLERA


ANGLER BANK PROPER - Billy Grimley, was used to find the wreck listed below using time and course of 14 minutes at 8 knots and following the contour to find:

3 SISTERS - Found by Walter Specht of the Margaret and named after his wife and her 2 sisters.

ROCKET GROUNDS - Low bottom found by Laddy Martin of the Rocket using a scanner.

IMMACULATA - Barges found by Laddy Martin.

BALD EAGLE - Found by Laddy Martin.

S/E IMMAC - Very low lying wreck found by Laddy Martin.

ASFALTO - Run over by Captain Richie Kessinger when blue fishing in the 50s.

BROADCAST - Charlie Dodd of the Optimist Queen gives the numbers out over VHF of a dragger hung up. Piece was easy to find due to large schools of scup which would settle up on it during the late summer and early fall and Laddy Martin never found the main pieces ince he was fishing the readings and 'sticky bottom' all around that area. Captain Richie Kessinger first to fish the main part. Laddy Martin latter on when in the Broadcast area, found another little wreck south of it.

EDNA'S BOTTOM - Captain Jay Porter found while scanning in that area found this spot which he named after a real life Edna.

COW COUNTRY ROCKS - Harold Wrege of the Elmar found it using Decca Navigator, though many will say Captain Al was the first to fish it.

AUSTIN W - Captain Phil Ruhle hangs up and puts a lighted buoy on it and tells Captain Al about it. Captain Al at that time had the Viking 7, was in the shipyard and quickly comes out and runs the 25 miles from Jones to fish it. He finds the buoy on it and zeroes it in with Loran A, and fishes it but the fishing was poor with one little blackfish caught. Goes out the next year to fish it and finds Captain Howard Bogan Sr. sitting on it.

ALS ASS - Captain Andy Peterson of the Marie 3 catches Al on this piece south east of Cholera during the late 50's/early 60s.

====================


If there are any stories or corrections, please let me know since my chicken scratch notes taken a while back may have had a few errors in names and who actually found the pieces listed above.


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Re: DEC 27 - FISHING UNITED.COM SPECIAL ARTICLE - WHO FOUND & FIRST FISHED THE SOUTH SHORE OF LONG ISLAND CODFISH WRECKS FROM 40s THROUGH THE 70s

Postby barbara anne » Tue Dec 28, 2010 12:55 am

Another great read and some real history.
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Re: DEC 27 - FISHING UNITED.COM SPECIAL ARTICLE - WHO FOUND & FIRST FISHED THE SOUTH SHORE OF LONG ISLAND CODFISH WRECKS FROM 40s THROUGH THE 70s

Postby Paul H / Emily S » Tue Dec 28, 2010 3:29 am

Great compilation Steve. Just to add some information, which may conjure up some additional thoughts/questions : the Experimental Buoy is also called the "Ball and Chain" (apprapo) and the Joe (apprapo too), as opposed to the inshore "Joe" aka Lido/Coal West. The Skippy (never knew where that name came from, thanks !)/Gunboat/Tarantula are all the same piece. The double schooners are also called the "Harveys" Schooner and the "Train Wheels" . Rocket Grounds pretty secretive, very rarely see anyone near there and yes low lying, thankfully no reference to it on the popular wreck charts, good fluke and seabass, cod haven't found it again, yet, to my knowledge.
Al's Ass known by several other names I think, one of which may start with an "A". Could be wrong on this .. Good seabass/fluke drop, in season, caught cod there too. How was Florence named ? Two interesting AWOIS symbols on the 40 20' line, one misplaced "old" yankee, the other the coastwise ?? Have some numbers , may need to run down ...
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Re: DEC 27 - FISHING UNITED.COM SPECIAL ARTICLE - WHO FOUND & FIRST FISHED THE SOUTH SHORE OF LONG ISLAND CODFISH WRECKS FROM 40s THROUGH THE 70s

Postby John F. Bogan Jr. » Tue Dec 28, 2010 6:31 am

Jimmy Matthews had the Cow for years. He had the dragger Chrissy James at the time. After towing offshore, he often would make a drift or two on the spot and always caught some monster cod.
The scalloper Diane Maureen hung a dredge in it. Those fellows now have the Christian Alexa. Joe Bogan got the numbers from them and was the first to anchor on it. He started coming in with some fantastic catches of cod, mostly the large variety, hence the name Cow.
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Re: DEC 27 - FISHING UNITED.COM SPECIAL ARTICLE - WHO FOUND & FIRST FISHED THE SOUTH SHORE OF LONG ISLAND CODFISH WRECKS FROM 40s THROUGH THE 70s

Postby captjoekingcod » Tue Dec 28, 2010 7:42 am

Awesome Steve....been waiting for this one. :D
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Re: DEC 27 - FISHING UNITED.COM SPECIAL ARTICLE - WHO FOUND & FIRST FISHED THE SOUTH SHORE OF LONG ISLAND CODFISH WRECKS FROM 40s THROUGH THE 70s

Postby Hawkboat » Tue Dec 28, 2010 8:09 am

Nice read Steve..lots of history there for sure.
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Re: DEC 27 - FISHING UNITED.COM SPECIAL ARTICLE - WHO FOUND & FIRST FISHED THE SOUTH SHORE OF LONG ISLAND CODFISH WRECKS FROM 40s THROUGH THE 70s

Postby ctwhitechin08 » Tue Dec 28, 2010 9:33 am

Edna's bottom was named by jay Porter because he found "a drop offshore as big as Edna's a*!" Lol.

59 pounder story Al Lindroth told me the same thing, while running to the Yankee he ran across what looked like a step on his machine, circled around and saw the same thing. Drifted it real quick and caught some HuGE bergalls. 59 is very low but Al told me fishing was ridiculous there for a long time.

Biggest Long Island cod I ever caught came from either the 59 Or skippy's I forget.
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Re: DEC 27 - FISHING UNITED.COM SPECIAL ARTICLE - WHO FOUND & FIRST FISHED THE SOUTH SHORE OF LONG ISLAND CODFISH WRECKS FROM 40s THROUGH THE 70s

Postby EC NEWELLMAN » Tue Dec 28, 2010 11:57 am

Some excellent facts you added there Paul!!!! Also excellent info there John on the Cow.

Experimental Buoy = Ball & Chain and Captain Jay Porter while dragging the buoy since it was used as a reference point for running time and course off of for the other 20 mile wrecks in the area, caused it to sink.

FLORENCE


From what I was told and the story was reconfirmed was that there was a woman on the boat when Sy Collins ran over some readings which they anchored on and caught the fish up. He felt it was such good luck having her on board that he named the spot after her, 'Florence.' A while later when the first Carmark NOAA wreck chart came out, the name FLORENCE was seen on it but it was not a wreck. Supposedly and this could be just some talk, someone's book was 'lifted' and that is how a number of the major spots around the 20 mile wreck area got out, one again being the Florence which was just a patch of open bottom where Sy Collins had made a great catch on.

ROCKET GROUNDS


I remember years back what I had to do to get this one spot, but by that time Rocket Grounds was a shadow of what it once was. Captain Laddy Martin had found the spot, but the Canisi family who owned the Blue Sea also had a number of spots right in that area with different Loran C numbers for Rocket Grounds. Low lying rocks/stones, and it will be a area where in the future we will take some scanner images of. Does it hold fish these days? Who knows, but with all the dogfish around it would be very tough to fish on till they clear out.

EDNAS BOTTOM


Yes that is the actual story about I believe a noted tavern 'person' who Jay Porter knew whose bottom was noted to be very wide.

SKIPPY


Captain Richie Kessinger knew the mate on the Viking Skipper who was called the 'Beard' and was on the boat that day when Buddy Dorman ran it over. Richie who was sitting on the 3 Fares took bearings from a NOAA chart and was then able to locate the Skippy using a scanner.

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Re: DEC 27 - FISHING UNITED.COM SPECIAL ARTICLE - WHO FOUND & FIRST FISHED THE SOUTH SHORE OF LONG ISLAND CODFISH WRECKS FROM 40s THROUGH THE 70s

Postby Paul H / Emily S » Tue Dec 28, 2010 5:14 pm

Edna and Joe owned the Poop Deck in Freeport, I beleive. I miss that place, the small horseshoe shaped bar and floors were so crooked you felt drunk just walking to the head...
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Re: DEC 27 - FISHING UNITED.COM SPECIAL ARTICLE - WHO FOUND & FIRST FISHED THE SOUTH SHORE OF LONG ISLAND CODFISH WRECKS FROM 40s THROUGH THE 70s

Postby ctwhitechin08 » Tue Dec 28, 2010 5:35 pm

And don't forget about the Jurassic park fish hanging on the walls. I drank there in the 90's but I guess that's what the 50's felt like because I felt like I stepped back in time in that place. Edna ruled that place with an iron fist but Joe Elliot was a sweetheart of a guy I had many great conversatiions with him. Overall a touch of nostalgia in that place.
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